I like books...

Post by Yo » Wed Jul 07, 2004 10:24 am

Yeah I really liked Mat until that point, mainly because he is simply a bad ass. I like Mazram Taim too.

Kabol's argument about thinking with their brain between their legs is exactly why Dave's argument is invalid. Like I said, most men are led around by that. Why do you think intelligent women have it made.

Post by **Kabol** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 10:27 am

If you want to compare WoT books 1-4 to A song of fire and ice, then we might have a heated debate on our hands. However, books 6-10 of WoT tip the scales far, far into Martin's favor.

There should have been two books after book 5. One which was made up of 6 and 7, and another that was 8,9, and 10. Slam em together, weed out the filler, and condense it down to typical WoT book length. Even then the last book covers what, a month?

Post by Yo » Wed Jul 07, 2004 10:31 am

Very well said Kabol, I blazed through the first 5. After Fires of Heaven, things were getting dragged through the mud. I think Phelps told me before I started reading them (right when book 10 came out) that it was orginally supposed to be a much shorter series, but he dragged it out.
Martin does a great job of jumping into the action, and just like he says in the chronology notes, there is time passing between each chapter from a little to a lot. You get the action, and leave out the boring stuff (the filler like Jordan used).

Post by **Kabol** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 10:39 am

Martin has time progression down to a fine art. It is fast-paced while tensions build, then he slows it down for big events. Really big events, like the battle of king's landing, are almost like bullet time. Points of view are told pretty much simultaneously. It is very similar to how battle scenes are done in movies.

Contrast this with Jordan's book 10. At the end of book 9, Rand *no spoilers*. At LEAST the first half of book 10 takes place before that event. Elayne has time to take a two chapter bath. Meanwhile, I have to wait for book 11 before I can see characters' responses to the event in book 9.

*edit* Yes I meant the first half of book 10

Post by **Payndar Circusdorf** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 11:55 am

You mean the first half of book 10, but yeah.

Post by **Payndar Circusdorf** » Wed Jul 07, 2004 11:57 am

I would also like to go on record here by saying Martin's recurring reference to sex drives pales beside Jordan's recurring reference to lace and brocades and spiced wine.

Almost everybody has a sex drive. It's a facet of the human experience that everyone has to deal with constantly. And it influences decisions.

But dammit, I am tired of reading about flowing lace in Jordan.

Post by **Liltyger** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 11:08 am

Bah, even Arya starts talking about cocks, men may think about sex 50 times a day but does that means it needs to be written about? No. I can see some of your points here, yes the world is more believable -but it's a fantasy novel. As for it being "deeper" You're going to have to define what you mean by that because the WoT world is much deeper from what I've seen.

When I read Jordan I get drawn into the novel, I can picture the people and the places I can get a real feel for the cities and cultures, but while I'm enjoying Martin's books there isn't enough information to draw me in like Jordan. Jordan's writing is so rich in symbolism, history, and hints of things that have happened and those to come, Matrin's writing seems lesser in comparision, not that it's lacking. Maybe I'll feel differently after I finish this book and reread the series sometime in the future, but I din't think so.

Post by **Payndar Circusdorf** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 1:32 pm

You're exactly right Dave.

Jordan does do an excellent job of hinting at things that happened, that you didn't see, and an excellent job of hinting at things that will happen in the future, that you haven't seen yet.

Martin, on the other hand, actually tells the damn story and does it excellently.

Jordan has completely lost that skill.

Post by **Kabol** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 1:44 pm

While I enjoy Jordan's history and how he refers to it, I do NOT like his "foreshadowing". Where his world may be deep (relatively speaking, this isn't Lord of the Rings here), his characters are not. The actions they take are completely predictable.

I don't like knowing everything that will happen in the future. He ruins all of his surprises *cough* Morraine *cough*. Contrast this with a large number of events that occur in Martin's books. You can't be certain that this ordeal won't be the character's last.

Post by **Payndar Circusdorf** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 1:50 pm

However you are never sure if that page is the character's last page.

Post by Yo » Thu Jul 08, 2004 1:53 pm

Like Syrio?
He was one of my favorite characters, yet they never mention if he is captured/killed etc. They just kinda stopped talking about him.
And Jaqen, what a f'n pimp.
Valar Morgulis

Post by **Payndar Circusdorf** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 4:31 pm

Is this the same Liltyger who listened to tape after tape of Ayla and Jandalar do Eurasia?

Post by **crazyaudi** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 5:22 pm

we where talking about canadien reading habits

this sums up everything nicely

Post by **Payndar Circusdorf** » Thu Jul 08, 2004 8:09 pm

Sounds right from what I've seen of Quebecois and Maritimers.

Post by **Ves** » Sat Aug 28, 2004 12:09 am

I finally got to read New Spring the other day starting the Wheel of Time series. FUCK THAT. Most boring read ever, then i read the synopsis of the other books in the series. They sound like LoTR with no ending. I was only reading WoT first cause the library i live above had most the books. I finallly broke down and drove acrose town to get A Game of Thrones and thank god i did. Best damn book ever. Im just 100 pages into it and I a blown away at Martins style of writing. Hell i've almost cried already on the thought one of the characters might have just died. I can't wait to read more but as for Jordan BURN IN HELL AND GET RAPED...TWICE.