Order of Hasson

Yo wrote:like what?

I seem to recall some pretty huge fucking trains in South Ro among other places.

and you compare a five minute corpse run at worst case to losing all the money you've ever acquired in a video game?

South Ro was miserable!

In Billy's defense, I dont think he understands the magnitude of the scam going on here. This isnt training a mob on someone, or even pick pocketing a gem or 2, this is someone who sets up a bot to scam people for hours on end, by abusing a system thats been in place since day 1 of WoW, but that no one else took advantage of because no one else has been either bold enough to bot in public, or lacked the basic respect most players have not to fuck with the AH.

Essentially, people who are moving either gems or equipment from one character to another are trying to make things fun for themselves by either twinking, getting gear they need for raiding or pvp, or gems for enchantments for either raiding or pvp, and guys like this are directly trying to PUNISH people for investing time and effort. While the scammed parties involved were careless about how they managed their items, that doesn't absolve these BOTTERS of what they've been doing. Their objective is essentially to make people as discouraged as possible with far more permanent effects than simply griefing somebody by killing them. Killing somebody is hardly permanent in an MMO and rarely much of a time sink. Taking triple to quadruple digits worth of gold from people is far more permanent because you're essentially taking their property. Scamming people who are too stupid to realize they're getting ripped off is completely different from outright stealing from people. That's why this is hardly comical.

Sounds to me like a reputable guild needs to get out there and charge small fees for secure trades.

And how would you propose they did these secure trades, with the neutral AH being the one and only way to move goods across the factions? Riak's bot, seeing their guild tag, would tremble in bot fear and bot respect, and turn itself off?

Seems now there is one alliance side too. Not sure if its Riak or not. Riakpwnsu was in felwood at the time. Seckssy was the name.

It's all friggin relative to the game. You aren't stealing someone's soul. If time is what you are worried about, why wasn't anyone worried about the time guilds spent getting them geared up before switching mains... or switching factions, for that matter?

Have any of you even tried bottomscanner? It makes a friggin sound when it finds something that could be conceived as a deal... You don't have to have a hack to exploit it. You could easily just sit on the couch and watch a movie with it running on a laptop and press the spacebar every 3-4 minutes.

It's nothing like the hack someone used to level to 70 in alterac valley...

** edited for grammar (it's ALL friggin relative)

If somebody is botting to 70 in AV, more power to them.
There's no difference between them sitting there and actually killing harpies or them botting kills.
Botting to level doesn't hurt anybody but the player that's doing it.
They aren't hurting me or anybody else any.

Sniping auctions whether botting or not is intentionally hurting other people.

I really don't know how you can't see the difference.

Primus662 wrote:And how would you propose they did these secure trades, with the neutral AH being the one and only way to move goods across the factions?

Who said anything about trading the goods? Trade a copy. It's simple, and after some inventory buildup actually more convenient than the current system.

Suppose you have guild called Escrowtes. Also suppose (for argument) that everybody trusts them.

Escrowtes keeps an agent on Horde Side (say, Orgrimmar) and one Alliance side -- Escrowtes_Orc and Escrowtes_Dorf.

Dobber, an Orc, wants to transfer his Shard of Ownage, the prime component of an uber weapon, which is valued at 3K. He doesn't have the cash to float this in the neutral AH above bot-sniping levels. So he goes to Escrowtes.

Dobber hands the Shard to Escrotes_Orc along with a transaction fee (say, 10g). Dobber logs out.
Dobbins, the dwarf Dobber wanted to hand it to, logs in. He meets Escrotes_Dorf and collects a Shard. Everybody's happy, and Riak never even saw it.

How? Escrotes_Dorf already had a Shard. Escrowtes the Guild still has the same inventory (one Shard), and gained 10g. Now if a player wants to transfer a Shard from Alliance to Horde, the same transaction occurs, only in reverse.

Yes this undoubtedly requires some heavy camping or raiding or whatever on the part of Escrowtes, as these transferred things cannot be common or else the price would be lower. But it seems to me that if botters are that much of a concern people would be willing to pay a premium to do the transfers. The simple matter is the botters are there and are not going to go away. This solution is obvious, and the community owes it to itself to do something about it.

Either that, or Blizz should fucking permit transfers across factions.

I have a problem, I have gone to the AH in tanaris and bought stuff from there. I had no clue to this arrangement, but I guess I could have inadvertently purchased someones transfer. I have never had anyone complain, and most of the items were fairly priced. So what do I do if I happen to see something or know that I can find great deals there? should I send a tell to people selling things just to make sure? Or shout out if some item is reserved for somebody? I would assume that if you place anything out in the public you have to understand the risk that it might be taken. The AH is a legitimate place to buy and sell things. What can bliz do if someone gets something through legitimate actions, and someone complains that they were transferring that item?

If Bliz wanted people to transfer items across factions they would have created a safe system to do it. Using the AH invites the risk of someone else grabbing that item. Using the AH to transfer items to other factions is circumventing a system Bliz has in place to restrict it. I cannot see how anyone can honestly argue against someone grabbing a item that was reserved to transfer to a apposing faction. And lastly.... I know this, your horde and alliance characters on the same account cannot buy from each other on the AH, so that is another example of Bliz restricting transfers (this was at least a year ago when I tried it).

If you got the item for 1 copper then yeah, somebody was transferring it.
You'll know if you sniped somebody's auction.

It's very obvious if somebody snipes an auction.

It's also pretty hard to actually catch people transferring items.

Most people 2 box when transferring items and have the other character already there to instantly purchase it.

if the game wanted people to move items from faction to faction without any penalty at all... they would have implemented a system to do so. Do not feel guilty at all for getting something at a discount.

There is no argument you can write, and no justification you can preach, that will ever make me or any other sane person think that its ok for someone to use a bot and some mods to scam people using the neutral AH. You can attempt to nitpick it however you want to, at the end of the day, hes a shitbag, and anyone who agrees with what he does is a shitbag by association. End of story, thanks for coming out, move along.